Official Luthiers Forum!

Thanks for the compliment Don!

Actually, I will be a well-read lady when my books arrive from LMI

Thanks for the great selection LMI!

They were shipped yesterday and I can hardly wait for them to arrive.

Serge mentioned that reading up on the process was a good start, so what Papa Bear suggests about starting out, this "cubby- bear" heeds.

Thanks again!

Proud of you Jeanne!!!!!

Don't forget to show me pics of your bandsaw my lady cubby-Bear!

Jeanne,

How many guitars do you have built? Are you a newbie?
If so, then if nobody has recommended Cumpiano & Natelson's book, Guitarmaking: Tradition and Technology, I heartily recommend you buy it and absorb it. I read it through cover to cover several times before I ever started building, and it was a great help. I also emailed Bill Cumpiano many times for help and advice, and he was gracious with his time and encouragement.
There are also (as you know) many folks on this forum, representing novices to professional full-time builders who will help you through virtually every detail. There are no dumb questions except the ones never asked, so if you're struggling with anything at all, just ask and we will all chip in with our $.02.

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Thank you very much Bob!

How many guitars? In my head - many. On the drawing board - many more. Completed - none. I am a newbie with a driving determination, if that tells you anything about where I'm going with this dream.

You are so kind to offer this book advice and I appreciate it very much.

Unfortunately, that title was not one I ordered, but I believe I saw it online through Border's as well. I shall order that shortly from whomever has this title available. Anyone else have suggested reading, please let me know

I had made a posting sometime earlier that I expect to get everyone's $.02 worth...just don't expect change!

everyones $.02 worth .. but its only a penny for your thoughts - thats where the change comes from !!!! Someone is MAKING a penny here ....but who ???

_________________
Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

[QUOTE=TonyKarol] everyones $.02 worth .. but its only a penny for your thoughts - thats where the change comes from !!!! Someone is MAKING a penny here ....but who ???[/QUOTE]

A penny for your thoughts is now $.02 due to inflationary considerations!

I don't believe there is a better book available than Cumpiano for understanding what it takes to build a guitar, and understanding how things work. I do several things just like he shows. But, like Hesh says, for some things there are more up to date methods. My second book recommendation would be Jonathan Kinkead. The Kinkead book is clear and packed with excellent photos. Together, these two books have everything you need.

Ron

_________________
OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

[QUOTE=Hesh1956]
What type of guitar, steel string, classical, etc. do you plan on building first? The answer to this question will impact book recomendations as well.
[/QUOTE]

Hesh, I plan on starting with a steel string and anything else to be considered along with that is still in a speculation phase. That is why I want to read as much as possible to start with and go from there. Of course utilizing all input from my OLF family will weigh heavily in my decision. You are correct in advising me to decide an initial direction of style and form to ease the reading load. Many thanks

Serge had mentioned starting with EIR and that advice is foremost in my mind.

But gosh, I was looking at some osage orange and thought WOW! But, I realize that particular wood choice is further down the road for a more experienced me.

I am leaning toward my first build being a d****n****t.

Now what to do

[QUOTE=old man] My second book recommendation would be Jonathan Kinkead. The Kinkead book is clear and packed with excellent photos. Together, these two books have everything you need.
Ron[/QUOTE]

Ron, That I have !!!!!

Many thanks!

Now what to do ??? Beer and Advil till the thought of a D***dn****t goes away. Soon you will be thinking OM ... repeat after me ..OM ...OM ...ohhhhm ..ohhhhhm ..(seated on floor, legs crossed, while holding hands outstretched and index and thumb together .... a little incense might help too.

_________________
Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

[QUOTE=Hesh1956] Not to argue with my good friend Don I would suggest though that contemporary guitar building does not subscribe to Cumpiano's methods completely. Even Bill Cumpiano now does some things differently since he was a co-author to the book. It's a very important book and probably the most important guitar building book but IMHO there are some better ways to learn now. But I agree that Cumpiano's book is a great addition to what you can learn from.
[/QUOTE]

No argument here!
Bill has changed a lot of things since The Book was written many moons ago. It is a good starting place to learn the fundamental things. Personally, I'm not into building with a workboard, but prefer molds. There are a number of things I do differently now, so yes, there are better ways to learn some stuff.

Just don't go out and buy a PLEK machine or anything like that...

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Jeanne, what kind of music do you listen to or play on a guitar? if you prefer country music or bluegrass, a DREADNAUGHT is the way to go, I SWEAR! Especially if you strum with a plectrum(say whut??? ), i meant a pick ...ahem!

For a less bassy sound like in fingerpicking style, i'd probably choose an OM like coach Tony said or an OLF SJ las per Michael Payne's fine drawings sold here!

I really love the OM-H that Hesh gave me, it's sound is huge no matter if i use a P***t**M or your F**G**S!

Bear with me please!

Sergio

[QUOTE=Jeanne] [QUOTE=old man] My second book recommendation would be Jonathan Kinkead. The Kinkead book is clear and packed with excellent photos. Together, these two books have everything you need.
Ron[/QUOTE]

Ron, That I have !!!!!

Many thanks! [/QUOTE]
Okay, I'm probably setting myself up for some abuse, but I think the Kinkead book is maddeningly incomplete!
Here's an example that comes to mind: This is the only flat-top building guide that actually has the fortitude to suggest cutting a dovetail neck joint. I thought, "good, finally!" Kinkead then goes on to show, with pictures, the technique with a router, using his self-built router jigs. So I then look, and look, and look again for his plans on how to build the jigs. They aren't there! Okay, so I start looking at the photos of the jigs, and they're shot from one angle, while he's using them, so I can't see enough detail to extrapolate. What was he thinking?!! He also makes a mention of cutting the joint by hand, but his description is so incomplete that someone who's never cut a dovetail before doesn't even have a chance of succeeding! There are other shortcomings as well, and I've found this book to be quite inadequate. The pictures are pretty, though.

Jeanne, I'd say to get the Cumpiano book, ignore his neck joint (but check out his new system on his website) and build or buy an outside mold. With that, and the helpful folks at the OLF on your side, you'll have all you need. Well, except for enough money to buy all the wood and tools you'll want!

[QUOTE=TonyKarol] Now what to do ??? Beer and Advil till the thought of a D***dn****t goes away. Soon you will be thinking OM ... repeat after me ..OM ...OM ...ohhhhm ..ohhhhhm ..(seated on floor, legs crossed, while holding hands outstretched and index and thumb together .... a little incense might help too.[/QUOTE]

Oh my....the voices in my head....OM....d****n****t....OM.....d****n****t

O.K. Let's get to the brass tacks of the matter, please.

Tony, I would be grateful for your input and reasoning as to why I should consider (or not) consider one over the other.

Any other OLFers who wouldn't mind weighing in on this issue? Please do!

Well, to say it in few words, I am realy kidding. I will be the first to stand up and say, I am not a dreadnoughtg fan, mostly because of the look, that kind of pear shaped body. I like curves on my guitars - ever see my florentines - they scare people !!! Anyway, that said, you want to build a nice D-not, I would say walk, no make that run over to Lances ... his burst Dread has to be the best dread acoustically to my ears I have EVER heard. It was astonishing, amazing, overpowering, and well, words cant describe it. One of my all time favs, and I only held it for a few minutes (unlike Serge and his Corn flakes, I shared with the others there !!!) Build what you see in your dreams, whatever it may be. You will know when you get there.

So - OM vs dread - you like bluegrass - I do, but I would play it on a small jumbo !!! dreads are really built for bluegrass, big honking lows, singing highs. You want something more controlled, even, round, go for an OM. thats my $.02 (no change required !!) OMs also sit on most folks bodies in better balance with the tighter waist shape. Did I mention I like the curves ..

_________________
Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

[QUOTE=Serge Poirier] Jeanne, what kind of music do you listen to or play on a guitar? if you prefer country music or bluegrass, a DREADNAUGHT is the way to go, I SWEAR! Especially if you strum with a plectrum(say whut??? ), i meant a pick ...ahem!

For a less bassy sound like in fingerpicking style, i'd probably choose an OM like coach Tony said or an OLF SJ las per Michael Payne's fine drawings sold here!

I really love the OM-H that Hesh gave me, it's sound is huge no matter if i use a P***t**M or your F**G**S!

Bear with me please!

Sergio[/QUOTE]

Serge, my great Bear to the North:

I listen to all sorts of music. Right now I'm listening to some 20-year-vintage Joe Satriani. Last night it was Beethoven.

When I'm stumming the sky is the limit.

Is the playing style all there is to consider between the two? If so, very interesting.

Then there is the question of whether I must stick with one over the other as I progress. Is it SOP (standard operating procedure) for a builder to stick with one over the other?

Is this also an issue of tooling? What would be the major tool component difference to consider?

Oh my, I believe I have asked too many questions at once. Sorry!

Posting while I am posting huh Hesh ... get back in the John and sand

Yeah what Hesh said - my first acoustic love - Larrivee L body with a florentine - go figure .. my number one is right off that very gutiar.

_________________
Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

Jeanne, Dreadnaughts have sides that are easier to bend for a beginner and als, the sound is loud! he he he

I love Dreadnaughts , does it show?

In fact, i love them all!

I'm beginning to think I should have started a new thread for this discussion

First, let me reiterate that I am not building for me, per se. This inspiration came upon me 2 years ago and never went away. The more I thought about the uniqueness of a guitar along with the artistry and passion involved in creating one I became more motivated and determined.

That having been said, my thoughts on this dream went one step further into legacies for each of my 3 nephews. Of course all contingent upon my success, which I envision more as a reality each passing day. Who knows what I shall do with any additional guitars I make.

The guitar I now play is a Hamblin Grand Concert, with a cut-away, western red cedar top, EIR sides/ back, 11" upper bout,8.8" waist, lower bout 15.25"........yeah, I know my guitar. The unfortunate issue is that I have small hands and the neck dimension is too big. I have had to learn to keep my thumb back in the palm of my hand to get a two fret spread and a 5 string reach. OUCH!

So there you know what I play and how it is, IMVHO, somewhat unrelated to what I am planning to do.

Or is it related?

Jeanne,

I like them all so whatever you decide is OKie Dokie with me.

Interesting point on the smaller hands, problems on the spreads due to neck width and size. The good news is that you can make yours a size that fits.

The Cumpiano book is an excellent reference, but like some of the guys have stated, once you get into building you will find alternatives, newer and better ways to accomplish some of the tasks. Here on the OLF I have learned a great deal, one thing for sure is to try some new things. On your first you will learn the basics and things will become more clear to you as you progress. The important thing is to get a Kit, and just start building. I spent entirely to much time in preparation, tooling, equipment, jigs, molds, templates, plans, etc. etc. etc. of course this was before I discovered the Forums and especially the OLF. I don't think they were around at the time. Get one done and the second becomes more exciting and easier, third the same and so on.

Good Luck

Mike

Just a clarification for my last post, i meant that i love all guitars, of all shapes and sizes, after 2 dreads, i feel it's now time for me to build an OM and an SJ, the great OM-H i received from Hesh sounds that great that i want to replicate this FANTASTIC sound!!!!!!

SergeSerge Poirier38930.972025463

I've only owned dreds, but it fits my music. My first build was a dred. I'm currently building twin dreds for my sons (surprise Christmas presents). However, my next will be an OM! It will be another surprise gift for my brother. He and I both learned to play on a $25 Sears guitar many moons ago. We played together constantly growing up, mostly around the house for our parents. My dad played too. My mother died in '94 and my brother has hardly touched a guitar since. I'm hoping the OM will rekindle some passion so we can sit on the porch and pick together again. Sorry, this was more info than you needed.

Anyway, you can build as many different kinds of instruments as you want to. I'm excited about the OM. It will be that curly oak from BobC, Lutz top from BobC, bloodwood bindings, purfling, rosette, and fretboard markers, ebony fb and headplate, chrome Schallers.

Ron

_________________
OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......